[00:00:00]

[00:01:18] Kalen Jordan-1: What's this additions deal? Dude, you're on the fence.

[00:01:21] David: What is,

[00:01:22] Kalen Jordan-1: you, you hedge booked a ticket. Is

[00:01:26] David: I did,

[00:01:27] Kalen Jordan-1: am I correct in understanding that you hedge booked it?

[00:01:31] David: I did. I didn't want the tickets to run out, so I bought one, But, I also was like, Hey, Shopify. Rep, do you have any discounts for this? Even though I already booked one?

[00:01:45] Kalen Jordan-1: You realize that's probably illegal to like hedge book something in Canada. Without

[00:01:51] David: it,

[00:01:52] Kalen Jordan-1: of atten intending, I believe. I believe it probably Is Yeah, you

[00:01:55] David: there probably is a lot of weird things that are gonna become illegal between the US and Canada soon, aren't there?

[00:02:00] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah. Like might, think you're trying to slide by a tart for something like that by like pretending you're gonna be there not actually being there.

[00:02:09] David: Dude, I was wondering about the tariffs, like, am I gonna have to pay Shopify more money?

[00:02:13] Kalen Jordan-1: don't think so.

[00:02:14] David: Is it like digital tariffs?

[00:02:16] Kalen Jordan-1: I saw some people talking about that too. I don't think it is. Um, but

[00:02:20] David: That's good

[00:02:21] Kalen Jordan-1: yeah, I think I looked it up or I saw somebody looked it up. It didn't,

[00:02:26] David: enough to not be worried about it.

[00:02:27] Kalen Jordan-1: yeah. it.

[00:02:28] Kalen Jordan-1: applies to goods, I think.

[00:02:30] David: Perf.

[00:02:31] Kalen Jordan-1: What, yeah, so I, I think that's true. And not. And not services.

[00:02:39] Kalen Jordan-1: I don't know exactly what a good is, but I I think

[00:02:43] David: Me either.

[00:02:44] Kalen Jordan-1: more of a '

[00:02:45] David: cause digital goods are a thing,

[00:02:47] Kalen Jordan-1: goods are a thing. That's true. That's true. look, don't quote me on that. I'm not a tax attorney. Okay. I'm not your lawyer. I would

[00:02:56] David: not financial advice.

[00:02:58] Kalen Jordan-1: though, at some,

[00:02:59] David: I,

[00:02:59] Kalen Jordan-1: point in the next months. You

[00:03:03] David: I, I want to, and so it's probably happening. I do, I, I like, I, I think it sounds awesome to meet everybody that I just read from on Twitter all the time. And then also like, talk to the product team

[00:03:20] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah.

[00:03:21] David: would be cool. Try and corner someone and ask 'em what's going on with exchanges.

[00:03:25] Kalen Jordan-1: Right. Yeah. It,

[00:03:28] David: Uh, it would be fun.

[00:03:30] Kalen Jordan-1: it was one of the, it was the first time in a long time that. 'cause the last few Magento conferences I'd gone to, I wasn't really, was kind of just like kind of phoning it in in a sense, or, or maybe it was just that I already knew a lot of people. So it was the

[00:03:44] David: Gotcha.

[00:03:44] Kalen Jordan-1: had that fresh experience of meeting people that I only knew online. And then meeting him in person. It was the first time having that in a while. So it was, it was kind of magical in that, in that way. Um,

[00:03:57] Kalen Jordan-1: bet it'll still be magical. And I feel like one of the , most fun things from the Magento,

[00:04:04] Kalen Jordan-1: imagines were like the hackathon beforehand and like talking to all the other devs.

[00:04:09] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah,

[00:04:10] David: like that's like all this is.

[00:04:12] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah. It's crazy how Dev focused It is. I don't think there's a hackathon, which now that you mention, it's kind of weird. Um.

[00:04:21] David: like they had some like actual sessions where you could do things. So maybe not a hackathon, but like

[00:04:26] Kalen Jordan-1: Right,

[00:04:27] David: all set something up together. I think that's pretty cool.

[00:04:30] Kalen Jordan-1: There's like working sessions. I know I went to, at least when I went to like a flow working session where there was, you were in a breakaway room and there was tables and everybody had their laptops out and you were going through like a, an actual building, an actual thing.

[00:04:46] David: Generating some flow logs

[00:04:48] Kalen Jordan-1: yeah. Yeah,

[00:04:49] David: the millions. Is there like a booth set up situation at all, or what is it like?

[00:04:55] Kalen Jordan-1: There are like stations that are , kind of like boots. I'd say they're booths, but they're like cool stations. , where, you know, there'll be like a couch and like a stand with somebody at it and a sign and you know, basically, yeah, they're booths, but they're like?

[00:05:13] Kalen Jordan-1: the better kinds of booths that aren't just the basic booths.

[00:05:16] Kalen Jordan-1: They're like, when you'd go to imagine like there'd be a, the fancier boots that have like a couch and like seven

[00:05:23] David: Yeah,

[00:05:23] Kalen Jordan-1: and like, except instead of

[00:05:25] David: you gotta walk around and not make eye contact with anyone.

[00:05:28] Kalen Jordan-1: Except instead of sales reps, it's like product managers. There's like

[00:05:32] David: That's cool.

[00:05:34] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah, It's, and then you're like, so what are you, the product manager?

[00:05:36] Kalen Jordan-1: And they'll tell you, you know, they'll be product manager of some specific thing. And, it's kind of awesome. It's kind of

[00:05:41] David: Yeah, that sounds great.

[00:05:42] Kalen Jordan-1: yeah, it's kind of amazing.

[00:05:45] David: They have swag at the booths?

[00:05:48] Kalen Jordan-1: I think they do. Yeah. I know we, talked about the swag thing and I was a little foggy. I'm still a little foggy. what all the swag was. I probably wasn't as, as,

[00:05:58] David: weren't focused on the swag. That's probably the right approach.

[00:06:02] Kalen Jordan-1: But swags fun, you know? If you have fun with it, you have fun with it. You know what would be a good, , swag category I think we haven't seen enough of is fidgets fidget toys

[00:06:13] David: Oh, that are silent.

[00:06:15] Kalen Jordan-1: silent ones. Super loud ones for you. Definitely silent.

[00:06:18] Kalen Jordan-1: ones. But like, I'll be standing next to you, like blocking anybody from giving you loud fidgets, intervening hastily. Um, But like my kids

[00:06:31] David: You know what was interesting just now is when you said swag category, I. That sounded like a lot of fun to say, so I just wanted to say that real quick.

[00:06:40] Kalen Jordan-1: How'd It feel? , how was that experience

[00:06:42] David: was nice. It just kind of goes

[00:06:44] Kalen Jordan-1: nice. , you could almost shorten it down to swagger, gory or something like

[00:06:49] David: swag. Good. Gory.

[00:06:51] Kalen Jordan-1: then, make that a business, make that a,

[00:06:54] David: Oh, there you go.

[00:06:55] Kalen Jordan-1: make

[00:06:56] David: Entire business based off of, uh, an amalgamation of words.

[00:07:00] Kalen Jordan-1: dude. I think we have our side hustle idea. Build out a little Shopify store called Swaggo.

[00:07:07] David: There you go.

[00:07:07] David: We sell digital goods. It's just this word.

[00:07:11] Kalen Jordan-1: reimagining the swag category. Um, yeah, so by the way, you gotta give a shout out to Taylor. , never remember his last name, but he's on Twitter and he's always giving, giving us, . Shout outs on Twitter, which is

[00:07:28] David: Yeah. Shout out to that guy. I appreciate that.

[00:07:32] Kalen Jordan-1: for having talked to him and tweeted with him 900,000 times.

[00:07:35] Kalen Jordan-1: You'd think I'd remember his last name by now. But he's the main tailor. He's the main tailor is the main, is

[00:07:41] David: Yeah, the main

[00:07:42] Kalen Jordan-1: thing.

[00:07:43] David: Taylor.

[00:07:43] Kalen Jordan-1: But yeah, like I think early on with the podcast, it's like those three dudes that actually like listen, that keep you motivated. So that's, uh, it's pretty cool. Um, but yeah.

[00:07:56] Kalen Jordan-1: I booked, my Airbnb today and I got, one downtown. 'cause

[00:08:01] David: Nice.

[00:08:02] Kalen Jordan-1: I got the, uh, like the Airport Hotel or like the Hilton Airport, something like that was the main one that was listed. And so I got that. But there was like nobody there. I mean, it was, I thought it was gonna be happening, but it just wasn't. So

[00:08:18] David: So you, you just got your own like Airbnb situation

[00:08:21] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah, just snapped up a little, which was crazy 'cause was looking at a place yesterday, it was 200 bucks or euros. I don't know why they had me on Euros , and

[00:08:31] David: that don't make no sense.

[00:08:33] Kalen Jordan-1: And so I was like, okay, fine. That's like a bit overboard, but fine. Let me just do it before somebody takes this one and then I'm outta luck again. And then when I changed the date range, it was like, I had it Wednesday to Saturday. I changed it Wednesday to Sunday and it went down to one 30 at night.

[00:08:52] David: Ooh, grab it.

[00:08:53] Kalen Jordan-1: I, so I locked it up. That was kind of cool.

[00:08:56] David: Was that Canadian dollars or Amer or US dollars?

[00:09:00] Kalen Jordan-1: You know, that's a good question. It was a, it was, it was a dollar sign, but it coulda, it coulda actually been Canadian.

[00:09:06] David: never know. Did you do a flight through Air Canada with that coupon code?

[00:09:12] Kalen Jordan-1: Coupon what coupon code?

[00:09:14] David: When I signed up with my hedge bot ticket, there was a, an email that said, go look at Air Canada, and here's a coupon code

[00:09:23] Kalen Jordan-1: that

[00:09:24] David: you haven't booked that yet.

[00:09:25] Kalen Jordan-1: That's cra No, I haven't booked it yet. Okay, great. I'll check that out. did look up the flights and Air Canada was the main, like nonstop one or the only

[00:09:34] David: Mm-hmm.

[00:09:34] Kalen Jordan-1: one me. And the return flight on Sunday was 8:00 AM which means I'm

[00:09:42] David: Ouch.

[00:09:42] Kalen Jordan-1: getting up at four 30 'cause you're supposed to technically get there two hours early.

[00:09:47] Kalen Jordan-1: So I'm gonna get there two and a half hours early to be extra safe. And then I'll just be sitting at the airport forever, So that's gonna be kind

[00:09:56] David: That sounds horrible.

[00:09:58] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah.

[00:10:00] David: So you're not just gonna get a later flight.

[00:10:02] Kalen Jordan-1: If I get a later flight, there's a nonstop or there's a one-stop flight, which I sort of promised myself I'd never do any stops on flights.

[00:10:11] Kalen Jordan-1: That you could miss 'em. Bad things can happen. , I believe terrorists are more likely to be involved in those types of flights as well. Um, um, onboard

[00:10:24] David: I mean, I feel like it's quite common to have a, some sort of like stop on a flight.

[00:10:31] Kalen Jordan-1: Listen, Matt, I read on Twitter that terrorist target those flights. I'm staying away

[00:10:36] David: Oh, okay. Gotcha.

[00:10:38] Kalen Jordan-1: nah, I'm

[00:10:39] David: do a nonstop then.

[00:10:40] Kalen Jordan-1: So maybe I'll do that because, it'll be kind of rough, uh, especially if

[00:10:44] David: Oh, I had a layover. I don't know if it's called a layover, if there's like no time between your flights, but I, I flew back from San Francisco last week and landed in Las Vegas and I was worried I was gonna get stuck there 'cause it was snowing

[00:10:58] Kalen Jordan-1: Mm-hmm.

[00:10:58] David: St. Louis and that, that airport was crazy. I guess it was like people in Las Vegas for Super Bowl or something,

[00:11:07] Kalen Jordan-1: right.

[00:11:08] David: but I could not get any food.

[00:11:11] David: I ended up going to a vending machine and just getting some like Fritos

[00:11:15] Kalen Jordan-1: Nice.

[00:11:16] David: on Fritos until midnight.

[00:11:18] Kalen Jordan-1: Yep. You gotta do it. all right, man, well hopefully we're gonna see you there, but,

[00:11:23] David: Yeah, I gotta make it happen.

[00:11:25] Kalen Jordan-1: we gotta

[00:11:25] David: Let's do it.

[00:11:26] Kalen Jordan-1: App

[00:11:27] David: do a live podcast. I.

[00:11:28] Kalen Jordan-1: We might be able to figure that out. I.

[00:11:30] Kalen Jordan-1: I have a love-hate relationship with Live podcast because they're kind of a, they're kind of, of a totally different thing and they kind of suck, but,

[00:11:38] David: Gotcha.

[00:11:39] Kalen Jordan-1: I shouldn't have said that because I want you to be, don't want you to have one less reason not to go.

[00:11:44] David: There's no reason to not go to this thing. No, I'm excited about it. I just gotta figure out, 'cause I, yeah, I gotta figure out my, I'm so bad at planning. That's my problem. Just like that is, uh, three-ish months away. I don't know what's gonna happen

[00:12:01] Kalen Jordan-1: Right,

[00:12:02] David: now and then, but you gotta just plan your stuff.

[00:12:05] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah, I'm pretty bad at too. I've, I've put these things off enough to where now I kind of just like, I, all right, lemme just do it. And then I just kinda, you know, I just anxiously bang it out. Um,

[00:12:18] David: of an adult sometimes.

[00:12:20] Kalen Jordan-1: yeah. Yeah. Approaching, approaching being an adult. , I did try. Operator.

[00:12:26] Kalen Jordan-1: Actually last thing before we get into some true Shopify content. So operator is, is the chat GPT thing for,

[00:12:33] David: Oh

[00:12:35] Kalen Jordan-1: controlling a browser.

[00:12:37] David: yeah. Tell me about it.

[00:12:38] Kalen Jordan-1: I had upgraded to the, to the 200 bucks, one for the deep research, which was ultimately kind of sucked. then I was like, oh, I gotta, I gotta find an excuse to use this operator.

[00:12:49] Kalen Jordan-1: before I downgrade again. but I hadn't thought of one. And I was like, oh, I, it.

[00:12:54] Kalen Jordan-1: can do the booking for me. That's like the classic use,

[00:12:58] David: Yeah,

[00:12:58] Kalen Jordan-1: the canonical

[00:12:59] David: demo.

[00:13:00] Kalen Jordan-1: that's the demo.

[00:13:02] Kalen Jordan-1: I said, Hey, find me a thing. It was horrible. It took four. Okay. It went to booking.com and it went and it went to pick the date ranges and it spent like a minute and a half clicking and you see it as it's going.

[00:13:17] Kalen Jordan-1: So it clicks the day range, and then it goes, oh, res selecting, and it reselect it and then it, it's, and you're looking at it and it's like in, it's like way in June. And then, but it finally figured it out. It took way too long. and actually it found this hotel, which was a li, a nice hotel called Reverie.

[00:13:38] Kalen Jordan-1: And it said it was 200 bucks. And I was like, wow, that's surprising. 'cause when I had looked, all the hotels were like 400 bucks a night, especially the ones that were downtown that were kind of nice. And so I was like, dude, it found something that's amazing. Like it's totally worth it. And then I was like, okay, okay, tell me what the overall cost is for it. for the whole stay or whatever. And then it, and then I see it looking now all of a sudden it's on the wrong date. It's on like June 6th or something like that. And then I let it chug, I let it chug and it goes, okay, the total amount is a thousand dollars something for the Hilton. Uh, something it picked, it was on a totally different hotel on a

[00:14:22] David: What

[00:14:23] Kalen Jordan-1: date. so I was just, I was done with it. .

[00:14:25] David: lame.

[00:14:26] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah.

[00:14:27] David: I feel like there's, uh, like we're in this situation where everyone's battling to release new stuff quickly and it just like has become slop to some degree. Is that how you feel with the operator thing

[00:14:39] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah.

[00:14:40] David: any good experiences with it?

[00:14:41] Kalen Jordan-1: none whatsoever. I mean, that was all I did, you know, there's gotta be some use cases that it finesses and, uh, mean I'm sure it's gonna get there. It did give me a tiny bit of a glimpse into just imagining when it's gonna be really

[00:14:54] David: Yeah,

[00:14:55] David: But every time you do it, don't you have to go in and tell it what you want it to do. I feel like the way that it would actually be useful is if you could tell like voice, like, pick up your phone, push a button, do this for me and tell me what you come up with. Instead of like, sit down at the computer, open the browser to the operator thing, type out the thing that you want, and then watch it.

[00:15:20] David: Do that thing like you just watching it do something that you could have done.

[00:15:25] Kalen Jordan-1: yeah,

[00:15:25] David: like I, I don't know. I feel like there needs to be another magical leap before it's like I'm just kind of like, man, with all of this stuff that's been coming out lately.

[00:15:35] Kalen Jordan-1: Well, it, it's, it's kind of like, something will come out that's kind of like hyped or it, it seems cool, whatever, and then it'll, and then it'll disappoint you, and then something else will just catch you by surprise. Like somebody mentions cursor, you go try it, you're like, holy shit, this is good.

[00:15:53] Kalen Jordan-1: And it, there wasn't this big splashy announcement, like you just, saw it kind of randomly. it's very hit and miss, like, which, things are good and,

[00:16:04] David: Yeah. And the only difference with Cursor is they like, it's still the same base model. They just integrated it. Well, I think that's the part that's weird is like we, we need better integration to make it actually useful. Like anytime I have notes, tell the model my notes, and then it knows where to put those so that it can retrieve them in the correct context next time.

[00:16:27] David: Like that's all the stuff that you could still have the base model, but then you also have this layer of organization around the outside. And I think that's the part that once that gets hit, it's like, okay, this is actually useful for me, like all the time.

[00:16:42] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah. It's like building stuff on top of the base models. And I think that they added support for oh three Mini, in cursor. , but then I saw one of them tweeted that they said most people still prefer Claude three, five, even though, you know, O three ME is supposed to be much smarter model, and I think I did test it in cursor once and Yeah, it was weird.

[00:17:03] Kalen Jordan-1: It wasn't that

[00:17:04] David: anecdotally, everyone that I've talked to who does any amount of code generation likes Claude the most for that

[00:17:13] Kalen Jordan-1: yeah, yeah. Totally. The only time I switch back to GPT is if, as if Claude Time's out and then I go, okay, Claude's tired, let me, let me switch over.

[00:17:23] David: ude.

[00:17:24] Kalen Jordan-1: But, but actually I haven't gotten timeouts like that in like, in like a week and a half now.

[00:17:31] David: Nice. It's that billion dollar investment they're getting.

[00:17:34] Kalen Jordan-1: oh, did they just get some cash money? That's good.

[00:17:37] David: Yeah. They got a bunch of money.

[00:17:39] Kalen Jordan-1: Nice.

[00:17:40] David: I forget from who, but it's a lot.

[00:17:42] Kalen Jordan-1: Gil,

[00:17:43] David: I, yeah, he's got that Shopify money now.

[00:17:47] Kalen Jordan-1: . No, I Gotta meet Gil. I still haven't actually met Gil. I didn't run into him last time. that's on the to-do list.

[00:17:54] David: Gotta make that happen. Oh, the investment was from Google, so Google invested a billion dollars

[00:18:00] Kalen Jordan-1: that's

[00:18:01] David: into anthropic.

[00:18:03] Kalen Jordan-1: Wow. That's weird.

[00:18:05] David: It is weird. Everyone's like messing around with each other right now, and then Microsoft is like not gonna be working with OpenAI as much. I saw something like that.

[00:18:14] Kalen Jordan-1: Right,

[00:18:15] David: What's happening?

[00:18:16] Kalen Jordan-1: Well, I think, there was like a clause in the OpenAI, OpenAI contract with Microsoft that was, that like once they reached a GI, their, whatever their guarantee was to use Microsoft or for Microsoft to have, unlimited access or something like that wouldn't be, , valid anymore.

[00:18:34] David: Hmm.

[00:18:35] Kalen Jordan-1: supposedly like, I think they might have triggered that clause or, or they're close or some weird thing like that. So I

[00:18:41] David: Interesting.

[00:18:43] Kalen Jordan-1: look for other options. Talk about a

[00:18:46] David: Satya is too smart for that.

[00:18:49] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah, he seems like a smart dude. alright, so Live Meta Fields is the app of the week.

[00:18:55] David: Oh,

[00:18:55] Kalen Jordan-1: this dude Olay Olay Thorpe, , on

[00:18:58] David: good

[00:18:59] Kalen Jordan-1: he, uh, he's the guy that I, I have no idea what country he's from. It's gotta be a cool country. I feel like it is a Nordic situation probably,

[00:19:06] David: Must be.

[00:19:07] Kalen Jordan-1: But he's the dude that built the espresso bulk editor and this one's called Espresso, Uh, live meta fields. it launched pretty recently. What it does is it, it generates meta fields, like for example, bestselling, , product. It has meta fields on in different places. so it'll have meta field product, meta fields that are live So it'll have like average number of orders on this product or,

[00:19:34] David: Uh, so live meaning there's some calculation behind the scenes that updates these meta fields.

[00:19:40] Kalen Jordan-1: it's ref, it's refreshing them, , continually. And it have like number of items reserved in the cart, in carts across the site, you know, so that you could display that on the product page. You know, you say, Oh, this is in 15 other people's carts, you know, act fast or

[00:19:57] David: Oh, interesting.

[00:19:59] Kalen Jordan-1: If you Pull up the site, there's a bunch of cool, uh, because I'm go, I'm going off of my pen and paper here, so I don't have, I don't have the site in front of me, but there's, .

[00:20:07] David: Pull that up.

[00:20:08] Kalen Jordan-1: A bunch of cool, ones in there like, it has like most popular variant. Then, uh, there's also, uh, flow integration. So some are, all of the meta fields have flow triggers, I guess for, you know, for when they get updated and things like that.

[00:20:25] Kalen Jordan-1: It's like this very simple idea. But I think he's done a really good job implementing it and it seems to have some cool, some really nice tie-ins,

[00:20:36] David: Yeah, this looks nice. 'cause if you've got those live, like now, I'm, I'm looking at this, I pulled it up and, the first use case that you think of is like, okay, display some of this information to the customer, but also you can have the meta field show up in the product list and the admin, so that lets you filter like stuff for you to look at from the admin side of things too.

[00:20:57] David: That's,

[00:20:57] Kalen Jordan-1: Right.

[00:20:58] David: cool.

[00:20:59] Kalen Jordan-1: I guess it also lets you, like, I guess you can't do certain, like, I guess you can't do a collection on an option, so you can't do like red, shirts based on

[00:21:10] David: Hmm.

[00:21:11] Kalen Jordan-1: option value red. I don't. I I,

[00:21:14] David: Yeah. The, the access to variance is like not there at all, like anywhere in Shopify.

[00:21:21] Kalen Jordan-1: right. So he has a way of just sinking an option to a meta field so you can use a meta field in the collection. then, I believe it also has ways of doing, like rolling logic into those meta fields. 'cause, you know, you can't combine like, and, and or conditions when you're defining a,

[00:21:39] David: Mm.

[00:21:39] Kalen Jordan-1: collection. think it gives you some ways to do some fancy business around that.

[00:21:46] David: Gotta love that fancy business.

[00:21:48] Kalen Jordan-1: yeah. So That's a

[00:21:50] David: That's interesting. I'll have to give that a look. See if there's like some way to do some custom live things or if like over time, if he's gonna be adding more interesting stuff there.

[00:22:02] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah. We had a use case, , on this one B2B site where we have a, this meta field pricing situation, where we're not using B2B catalog pricing because their logic is a little too complicated. Um, so we use, different meta fields , on the company on the variant, , to determine which price they get.

[00:22:22] Kalen Jordan-1: And then like per category, price tiers and things like that. And, I'd let them know like, you, you're not gonna be able to sort like this, sort on price is not gonna work for this, you know, the default sort on price. 'cause prices aren't in that price field. And so we were looking into whether we could, do some, calculations with, do something on, with meta fields for, you know, those different price points for different companies. So I was thinking we could either use them for that or we could build something similar out ourselves.

[00:22:53] David: So these price meta fields that you have are like probably for display on the front end, and then do you have a corresponding like cart

[00:23:02] Kalen Jordan-1: yeah.

[00:23:03] David: function or something that mirrors the price?

[00:23:06] Kalen Jordan-1: yeah.

[00:23:06] David: Gotcha.

[00:23:07] Kalen Jordan-1: So, you know, it's kind of a cool little solution, but. , you do, you lose the, the sorting. And also, even if you do add support for custom meta fields for, filters in search and discovery, pretty sure you can't do any meta fields for sort

[00:23:29] Kalen Jordan-1: I think the sort by price just goes off of the price field.

[00:23:31] Kalen Jordan-1: I don't think there's any way to plug that into a meta field.

[00:23:36] David: gotcha. There is a way to do, like, I, I have a meta field for features that you can put into the search and discovery app as filters.

[00:23:44] Kalen Jordan-1: Mm-hmm.

[00:23:46] David: Maybe that works, but if it's at the variant level, then probably not.

[00:23:52] Kalen Jordan-1: yeah, I have to take a look. I always forget what's included in there. What is it? I have to start clicking around and figure it

[00:23:58] David: I did something like, holds a laptop or has a zipper or like fits under airplane seat. So I've just made a meta field, like a meta field list,

[00:24:07] Kalen Jordan-1: Mm-hmm.

[00:24:07] David: and that worked.

[00:24:08] Kalen Jordan-1: Nice.

[00:24:10] David: But nobody uses filters, so I abandoned it.

[00:24:12] Kalen Jordan-1: Oh really?

[00:24:15] David: Yeah,

[00:24:15] Kalen Jordan-1: They don't take the time to click into 'em.

[00:24:19] David: yeah. Just based on our click tracking, there wasn't much activity there. People mostly click in the, into the like top level categories and then people like scrolling, so they just scroll.

[00:24:30] Kalen Jordan-1: That's funny. Yeah. That I feel like I, yeah, I'm kind of same. Like I don't, I don't do a lot of filtering.

[00:24:39] David: The only time I do filtering is when I'm shoe shopping 'cause I have ridiculously sized feet. And so I have to be like, okay, only show me the shoes that come in size 15. 'cause I, I don't got time to click through every single one of these and then feel bad about you only having size 13 shoes.

[00:24:59] Kalen Jordan-1: Right. But that's like a very specific thing where you've like run into a specific issue before and you know you're gonna always

[00:25:06] David: Yeah.

[00:25:07] Kalen Jordan-1: but it's not like you're gonna be clicking into like, has shoe laces, filter or like color

[00:25:15] David: Yeah. A lot of customers make decisions based off of the, like the silhouette of the product, like whether or not they like the way it looks. And so they're like, for us especially, it's, it makes sense to scroll through and just get a preview of everything.

[00:25:31] Kalen Jordan-1: yeah, good times. Good times. Next up, registration flows. I built a couple of these now where, well, I just, I just worked on a new one where it's like a, like a registration, , approval flow for this hemp site where there's a couple steps they have to, like validated tech, uh, a phone

[00:25:54] David: RU 21.

[00:25:55] Kalen Jordan-1: with a, yeah, text message, that kind of stuff.

[00:25:58] Kalen Jordan-1: And then, it ties into new customer accounts, which the client, we managed to convince them to stick with that, not to do some weird external onboarding

[00:26:06] David: Nice.

[00:26:07] Kalen Jordan-1: But the way I did it is that like the, customer registration page, there's like a progress bar. It's like email verify, phone verify, identify, verify, and the first step says like, verify your email.

[00:26:20] Kalen Jordan-1: And then when you click in to verify your email, it goes to the new customer accounts login. Just the native Shopify login. 'cause there's no way around that. And

[00:26:30] David: Mm-hmm.

[00:26:30] Kalen Jordan-1: once you validate the code, it just bounces you back into the registration flow.

[00:26:37] David: Nice. Lucky you coming in after they implemented that.

[00:26:41] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah,

[00:26:43] Kalen Jordan-1: So I, that was the best way I could figure to do it, with the constraint that they

[00:26:48] David: Yeah,

[00:26:49] Kalen Jordan-1: login flow. , and then if they happen

[00:26:52] David: no, that's a good idea.

[00:26:53] Kalen Jordan-1: like if they happen to log in before that, which you can't really avoid, they could always do that. If they get to it, then it'll just drop them right into the second step automatically

[00:27:03] David: So that's how you handle it. When they come back, they like, if they're logged in, then you just always put 'em in the second step. Nice.

[00:27:10] Kalen Jordan-1: And then they do other stuff and then, you know, you set a meta field for whether they're approved or not, and then you can use that to determine if they can shop and, um. Actually, the one thing that the deep research thing did find for me when I was trying to figure out like an app to build for B2B is it said that there were a lot of these like customer approval apps or registration like apps. And I was like, that's funny. It didn't feel like that was a category to me, but

[00:27:41] David: Yeah,

[00:27:41] Kalen Jordan-1: I was thinking maybe I could do this as a, maybe there's other people that need some that type of an app.

[00:27:47] David: That could be interesting

[00:27:48] Kalen Jordan-1: yeah,

[00:27:48] David: because yeah, you, you have some good experience with that stuff, like collecting extra information about a customer during the signup period.

[00:27:56] Kalen Jordan-1: have gotten a couple reps in on the, that type of stuff, so could come in handy, and the other red flag about that research I did is that a lot of people were asking for features that, other apps have, but they're not available for like, the lower Shopify plans.

[00:28:16] David: Hmm.

[00:28:17] Kalen Jordan-1: to mimic some of the functionality that's in plus, or in,

[00:28:22] Kalen Jordan-1: I think maybe plus or maybe the higher price tier. , they wanted something that wasn't available in like the lower two price tiers of Shopify, which I was like, , that's not a good idea. Like, you, like if you're gonna build, if you, if you're gonna build an app, you specifically want to build something for plus stores, especially to get started.

[00:28:43] Kalen Jordan-1: So,

[00:28:44] David: nah. You're a man of the people.

[00:28:46] Kalen Jordan-1: nah,

[00:28:46] David: , come one, come all. I will implement Shopify's plus features as apps that are all free.

[00:28:52] Kalen Jordan-1: I get my money right, I'll be a man of the people. Show title?

[00:28:59] David: Hacker.

[00:29:00] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah.

[00:29:03] David: Yeah. You, you, uh, you did a deep research for me to figure out what I should ab test next, and that did not, that did not give us good stuff.

[00:29:13] Kalen Jordan-1: I send it to you?

[00:29:15] David: Yeah, you sent me a screenshot of what it was doing. It was like,

[00:29:17] Kalen Jordan-1: it was so bad,

[00:29:18] David: it was like looking up like metal compared the Qna site to a metal working website.

[00:29:27] Kalen Jordan-1: In

[00:29:27] David: What,

[00:29:28] Kalen Jordan-1: I don't know if I sent this to you 'cause it was so dumb, but in the end it was like, test your button color. I kid you not dude, I kid you

[00:29:38] David: where?

[00:29:38] Kalen Jordan-1: It was like at the end of like 30 pages. No, because what deep research does is it gives you this massive amount of content. I feel like that's why everybody feels like it's valuable

[00:29:49] David: It's PhD level. 'cause it's just like droning on forever.

[00:29:54] Kalen Jordan-1: But like, I always want like a small amount of actually useful, actionable info as possible. So

[00:30:01] David: Yeah.

[00:30:02] Kalen Jordan-1: I asked like a follow up question to that massive thing. I was like, so just gimme the most important highlights. And it was like, test the button, color test free shipping was like the second one. It was the stupidest thing. So yeah, unfortunately I was like, damn, if it comes with

[00:30:18] David: Gotta get my button colors right?

[00:30:20] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah.

[00:30:22] Kalen Jordan-1: It's like if it comes up with something good, I might, I might have to hold this hostage for a

[00:30:26] David: Yeah.

[00:30:27] Kalen Jordan-1: bucks. Be like, David, gimme five bucks and I'll, I'll hook you up with this

[00:30:32] David: I'll release this.

[00:30:34] Kalen Jordan-1: or else I'm gonna send it to your competitors.

[00:30:37] David: Yeah. Figuring out what the AV test is hard and then like you never feel good about it until you test it and then you're like, okay, that sucked. Or, oh, that's interesting.

[00:30:49] Kalen Jordan-1: dude. How did your offsite thing go with the AI talk and everything you were gonna do?

[00:30:54] David: It was great. I ended up, , I don't know if I told you any, anything about it, but we, it was me and the, the CMO at the company just talking about AI use cases and like telling people how they can use it for like recipes and stuff like that in their personal life to just get them kind of associated with what it is.

[00:31:15] David: And then I talked about like how it's not Google. Like , your prompt can't be like how you do Google searches. 'cause like when you're doing Google searches, you type something and then you're given a list of options and then you make a second choice to like, okay, which one of these options is actually helpful for me, but you need to put that energy into your prompt and then you'll get some better stuff.

[00:31:37] David: So that was good. And then I ended it by playing. , Dungeons and Dragons text-based adventure with the entire company.

[00:31:45] Kalen Jordan-1: Nice.

[00:31:46] David: And it was awesome. We ended up picking a magical corporate, , environment and like we found a, a magical staff of like elevated brand. Like there, there's all these like kuana words and it just like the Chachi, bt like sprinkled them in through the whole thing.

[00:32:09] David: It was hilarious.

[00:32:09] Kalen Jordan-1: okay. Nice. Wait, so did you do like a

[00:32:12] David: I'll send you that prompt. It's like a, it was a big prompt I found on GitHub

[00:32:16] Kalen Jordan-1: Oh,

[00:32:16] David: and it goes through a bunch of stuff and then at the very bottom I was like, we're doing, we're playing this at the Ana offsite, so sprinkle in some ANA things and it did a great job.

[00:32:28] Kalen Jordan-1: That's so

[00:32:29] David: It goes through like steps, and then you, like, you roll a D six to figure out what the outcome is for one of your choices, and it actually generates a Python script and runs the D six right there and tells you if you win or lose.

[00:32:40] Kalen Jordan-1: Nice.

[00:32:41] David: It's a fun one.

[00:32:42] Kalen Jordan-1: So is it like, do, is it like you went through the prompt interactively when you were it together, or,

[00:32:52] David: No, I didn't run through the prompt with everyone. I was like, we talked a bit about like, here's what prompts are,

[00:32:58] Kalen Jordan-1: ah,

[00:32:58] David: how it's different than what you're used to. And as an example of what a prompt can do, this was like a five to six paragraph prompt that I just copied and pasted in and I skipped over it just to play the actual like outcome from the response.

[00:33:12] David: And then each time you, like, you pick an action and then the, it'll say like, okay, this is what happened. Now what do you want to do? It's a pretty awesome prompt.

[00:33:21] Kalen Jordan-1: That's cool. Gonna Check that out.

[00:33:24] David: Check it out.

[00:33:26] Kalen Jordan-1: it out. And then, with the AB test stuff, , because I know you were, you're doing like a new test every week. How's that going? Are you figuring out.

[00:33:32] Kalen Jordan-1: some good tests or are you, are you like, Yeah,

[00:33:36] David: I think we have a good one right now. It's been running for a week. I need to run it for another week. 'cause what I decided was like our business cycle is a week. And so we should run it based on some number of weeks. And so we started off with like, okay, we gotta run AB tests for two weeks.

[00:33:51] Kalen Jordan-1: Mm-hmm.

[00:33:52] David: The first one that I ran failed, didn't work well. Like we noticed that a lot of people clicked the dimensions and care section,

[00:33:59] Kalen Jordan-1: Mm-hmm.

[00:33:59] David: Which is below the fold, and it's like an accordion that you click and it opens up. So the hypothesis was to move that up higher somewhere. And we ended up moving it into the description area, but then that made the description super long.

[00:34:14] David: So by default we collapsed it and we found that, , conversion was worse , when you were on that side. And also no one clicked the show more button.

[00:34:23] Kalen Jordan-1: Okay.

[00:34:24] David: we were like, all right, well that one sucked and we probably should have realized that. But, , this one that's running now is pretty good. We're just talking about, , our two year warranty by just putting two year warranty texts there and then, and it's looking good.

[00:34:37] David: So I think we'll know, like if this turns out to be good, after another week, we will play more with like warranty language on the PDP and see if there's a better, more optimal place for it.

[00:34:50] Kalen Jordan-1: Oh, cool. Yeah, I can see how that, that feels like it.

[00:34:53] Kalen Jordan-1: would work. Like just.

[00:34:55] David: Yeah,

[00:34:55] Kalen Jordan-1: Emphasizing that?

[00:34:57] David: that makes sense.

[00:34:58] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah. Like the first one you were talking about. I was just like, okay. I think, yeah. Okay. Like, you know,

[00:35:06] David: What does deep research think about that?

[00:35:09] Kalen Jordan-1: nice. Everybody loves it. Everybody loves a nice long warranty.

[00:35:15] David: Everybody loves an AB test. That seems like it's gonna be successful. At least I do. I gotta get those successes, man.

[00:35:25] Kalen Jordan-1: You're gonna start testing like super obvious stuff, like just to get

[00:35:30] David: Change all the buttons to blue.

[00:35:32] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah. What would the most obvious thing possible be that would work?

[00:35:39] David: I saw one, there's another guy on Twitter, Shopify realm. I think his name is Kevin. I also don't remember his last name. And , he also has like an interview series, but his ab test was make the ad, make the checkout button bigger.

[00:35:54] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah. Right,

[00:35:57] David: That seems like one that probably, maybe we should try out, but it's also like how big we make in this button. And then separately we have to like think about how luxurious the site feels. So I can't do wacky stuff.

[00:36:10] Kalen Jordan-1: right. Have you ever done one of those like things where there's like a video of a person in the corner talking to you? Like a video, A video salesperson?

[00:36:21] David: Like they just walk in from the side of the screen? No,

[00:36:26] Kalen Jordan-1: dude,

[00:36:27] David: that

[00:36:33] Kalen Jordan-1: I've always wanted to do something like that

[00:36:35] Kalen Jordan-1: That's funny.

[00:36:36] David: I keep joking that I'm gonna put confetti on the site at some point.

[00:36:41] Kalen Jordan-1: Like

[00:36:41] David: Like snow falling.

[00:36:43] Kalen Jordan-1: upscale, confetti,

[00:36:45] David: Yeah, exactly. The confetti's black and white.

[00:36:50] Kalen Jordan-1: like very understated. Oh, man. Man. I'm still trying to think like, what is the most, like, bigger pictures maybe. I don't know. All right. Moving on.

[00:37:06] David: There's a, like showing the, like making sure that the customer understands how big a certain bag is, but also I'm very bag brained. So like , in general, in e-commerce, I think it's, make sure the stuff that's important is above the fold, which is just like a thing that people know.

[00:37:24] Kalen Jordan-1: but.

[00:37:24] David: Oh, one of the ab tests that we ran a while ago that was obvious afterwards is we used to have, we do still have these packing videos, and it was the last image in the media gallery.

[00:37:37] David: And we tested moving it up to be the second image. And that was like an obvious, like, this is way better in terms of conversion. And so now it's just in the second spot. So there's some, there's some like pretty easy things that you can do when you just think about the fact that like, I. If someone's on mobile and you have 10 images in your media gallery, not everyone's gonna make it all the way to the end because people have low attention span.

[00:38:00] David: So put the stuff that really shows it off higher up.

[00:38:04] Kalen Jordan-1: What about, a really nice video as the product shot that like shows the product in action type of a thing?

[00:38:14] David: Yeah.

[00:38:14] Kalen Jordan-1: I'd imagine.

[00:38:15] David: a lot. If you go to like a, a lot of the luxury brands have some sort of really nice video in their media gallery, but it's never the first thing. It's always like somewhere in there.

[00:38:25] Kalen Jordan-1: Right. I feel like that would, unless it killed your like, performance, I feel like that would have to do pretty well. Just like

[00:38:35] David: Yeah.

[00:38:35] Kalen Jordan-1: a really snazzy

[00:38:36] David: I, I have to talk to the creative team about, like, we can't have, we can't have a video that's a minute and a half long and have like four of those on one page because people's phones will just start exploding.

[00:38:49] Kalen Jordan-1: No,

[00:38:49] David: That's not gonna work.

[00:38:50] Kalen Jordan-1: it would have to be optimized, like maybe like eight seconds long that

[00:38:54] David: Yeah. Super short.

[00:38:56] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah.

[00:38:57] David: Yeah.

[00:38:57] Kalen Jordan-1: that would take an insane amount of work to actually do that for all the products, but I think might be like, I think that probably work.

[00:39:06] David: Oh yeah. Videos on the PDP are super helpful, especially when you're showing off like, here's all the stuff that you can put in this bag and like, here's where your key goes.

[00:39:13] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah. So I was doing some web hooks in hydrogen, web hook processing. And it occurred to me that because like webhook processing can get expensive, you know, if you're dealing with, product updates or customer updates or whatever, like, that's why flow doesn't have any update triggers.

[00:39:32] Kalen Jordan-1: 'cause dealing with all , the update web hooks are like super expensive.

[00:39:37] David: Hmm.

[00:39:37] Kalen Jordan-1: but then I was like, wait a minute, could do like infinite web hooks into hydrogen For free.

[00:39:47] Kalen Jordan-1: I don't

[00:39:48] David: free.

[00:39:49] Kalen Jordan-1: I was just thinking about that. So I, I don't know if I must be missing something, because

[00:39:55] David: Well, I, I saw you say something about that. The one response was that probably breaks terms of service, so.

[00:40:03] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah, dude, , and I'm blanking on his name 'cause he is really smart. He always replies with really useful replies. He replied that, and I was like, oh, shit. I, there, I knew there had to be something. so.

[00:40:15] Kalen Jordan-1: then I asked him, I, I, I searched it. I looked it up. I was like, wait, what, what are the terms? Because I was actually, I had to build a web hook for this like, , identity verification thing. It's like a low, it's like a low volume web hook. But, and then he never replied back. I was like, dude, tell me like If there's something specific here, like tell me. I don't know if he was just trolling or what, but, I couldn't find it.

[00:40:36] David: If there is something you could always use CloudFlare. I'm just gonna keep mentioning CloudFlare 'cause I think it's awesome.

[00:40:41] Kalen Jordan-1: yeah, no, I mean, no, CloudFlare is great. CloudFlare is great. I'm just saying it's not free.

[00:40:46] David: It's not free. Well, kind of, I got some stuff on there that's just that I've never paid for. 'cause it's so low.

[00:40:54] Kalen Jordan-1: they have

[00:40:54] David: But I guess if you're getting

[00:40:55] Kalen Jordan-1: right.

[00:40:57] David: Yeah, they do. And hydrogen is free as long as you're paying Shopify for a shop. Is that, is that what it is? Okay.

[00:41:05] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah. Dude. Let's let's spin up a test on your store.

[00:41:10] David: Yeah. Let's,

[00:41:11] Kalen Jordan-1: Let's

[00:41:12] David: let's test the limits here.

[00:41:13] Kalen Jordan-1: have it trigger every single time, any web book fires, update or create, and let's just smash it and see if your rep notices

[00:41:24] David: Yeah. How long until someone reaches out about this?

[00:41:27] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah.

[00:41:29] David: I mean, I got a good number of flows going now. I feel like that generates a lot of work.

[00:41:34] Kalen Jordan-1: Oh yeah.

[00:41:35] David: Like every time someone places an order, there's like, I don't know, 10 to 20 different flows that do stuff.

[00:41:41] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah. Was doing some work on this one site that has a pretty decent volume, like it seems to get like multiple orders per minute.

[00:41:47] David: Nice.

[00:41:48] Kalen Jordan-1: and so I set this flow up and I was just gonna like test, know, some stuff. So I turned it on and then as I'm turning it on, it's getting orders run through it like every minute. And I, I sort of felt bad, you know, I sort of felt like, damn, like I'm kind of using up a lot of flow usage just for testing. , and then I just realized like the scale that flow operates at is

[00:42:11] David: Yeah,

[00:42:12] Kalen Jordan-1: Sir,

[00:42:13] David: it's really cool.

[00:42:16] Kalen Jordan-1: I'm so curious to know what the infrastructure is. Like, is flow somehow isolated to your store instance, is it like, you know what I mean? Is the compute isolated somehow

[00:42:29] David: So when you look at the logs now, you can see a response from Shopify about the start of the webhook.

[00:42:35] David: And you can see like the way that the ID is structured, it's like job underscore something. So they must have some like massive queuing system that it's running off of.

[00:42:46] David: But I, I feel like the way that they're set up, it would be weird to have separated infrastructure. So they're probably just doing some level of permissioning and having like everything like their resources in general available. Otherwise it wouldn't be very cost effective to have a separate infrastructure for every Shopify store.

[00:43:03] Kalen Jordan-1: Oh yeah. That'd be

[00:43:03] David: But I don't know,

[00:43:05] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah.

[00:43:06] David: to get some like insider info on Shopify's architecture at additions. I.

[00:43:13] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah. I'm so curious about it. And so Flo just released now there's up to 14 days of logs. There used to be only seven days. , and Paul, I dunno if you noticed that. He posted about it on Twitter and

[00:43:26] David: Yeah. That's awesome.

[00:43:28] Kalen Jordan-1: it was like, I don't know if he said it was like a year's worth of work going into, , kind of like re-architecting their storage around logs. In order to be able to roll that out. And I was like, dude, can you, Ima like, I was just imagining how much does that seven days worth of logs cost, like across all the flow? It's gotta be absurd.

[00:43:52] David: it's gotta be fun to work on that infrastructure 'cause there's just like so much volume coming through. Like I, I felt cool yesterday 'cause I had to help someone restore. A snapshot of an RDS instance in a, in AWS and I was like, yeah, I got, I can do this in aws, but Shopify's got, like, I don't know, I, at one point they were running off of, , Google Cloud, right.

[00:44:15] David: But they probably are split up across different infrastructures now, so like I bet they got some crazy stuff going on.

[00:44:25] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah. I have no idea. I'd be curious to know.

[00:44:28] David: Did you ever get into like AWS infrastructure things?

[00:44:31] Kalen Jordan-1: no, dude, I, I've cracked open a WSA handful of times. The navigation just, uh, just drives

[00:44:38] David: Oh, it's so bad.

[00:44:39] Kalen Jordan-1: so

[00:44:39] David: And the docs are bad too.

[00:44:41] Kalen Jordan-1: I've, I've never like had a project where I had to just get in there and do it. I mean, I've just done some, like S3 stuff and you know, I really

[00:44:48] David: Gotcha.

[00:44:48] Kalen Jordan-1: with it. Um,

[00:44:50] David: you don't really have to, you just have CloudFlare or fly IO or Hydrogen and just throw your JavaScript in there and run it baby.

[00:44:59] Kalen Jordan-1: yeah, yeah. There's like wrappers now, I guess. So CloudFlare is, is like a wrapper on top of AWS or, or does

[00:45:08] David: I don't know, actually. I kind of always assumed that they had

[00:45:12] Kalen Jordan-1: They

[00:45:12] David: something going on on their own. Yeah,

[00:45:15] Kalen Jordan-1: yeah, That makes sense. Otherwise, they wouldn't be able to offer such high free tiers.

[00:45:21] David: yeah, exactly.

[00:45:23] Kalen Jordan-1: buy again, new customer accounts. Okay. So I, , you know, the new customer accounts in the order history, you can, there's a buy again button to, um, Yeah.

[00:45:38] Kalen Jordan-1: So we, I had this customer that has a bunch of custom stuff on their front end product page, and they saw an order come through that wasn't, it looked like something was broken on the product page because of how the order was coming in without the line item attributes. And then I

[00:45:53] David: Ooh,

[00:45:53] Kalen Jordan-1: Custom attribute on the order that said from new customer counts. And I was like, oh, maybe this came from that buy again button. And sure enough, that's, that's what that attribute is for.

[00:46:05] David: I did not know about that. I need to take a note real quick.

[00:46:08] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah, I.

[00:46:09] David: That sounds

[00:46:12] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah. Yeah, it did. And it, and for this one client, it did. And so then I was like, okay, I'm sure you can disable that. I was, I was like, I'm pretty sure I've gone into the customer accounts section and seen how to disable that. But I went in there and you can't, there's no way in the customer accounts configuration deal

[00:46:30] David: dang.

[00:46:30] Kalen Jordan-1: disable it, but, you can contact support, and support Will will do it for you. Um,

[00:46:38] David: button behind the scenes.

[00:46:39] Kalen Jordan-1: Get 'em,

[00:46:40] David: have to,

[00:46:40] Kalen Jordan-1: get 'em to,

[00:46:41] David: might have to get that button clicked on my shop.

[00:46:43] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah.

[00:46:45] David: I have an, , a similar issue, you remember we were working on loop exchanges, still working on it a little bit late, but we'll get there. , but they have this option to shop on store where you can, like, you're doing your return and then you can click like, what is it called?

[00:47:00] David: Instant exchange. And, what they do is they take you to the store front end and their app has, uh, an app block that like intercepts the request and it's like, oh, okay. This is a loop on store exchange. So they display the credit that's available at the bottom of the screen. And then you just put stuff in your cart and then you click checkout.

[00:47:21] David: And then when you click checkout, instead of going to the Shopify checkout, it instead takes you back to loop. And they just send like the current cart contents with that request, but it doesn't support custom properties. So like that's a lot of, we do gift boxes with custom properties. We do monogramming with custom properties.

[00:47:40] David: And so it's like, okay, well

[00:47:42] Kalen Jordan-1: an issue.

[00:47:43] David: guess we're gonna have to figure that out.

[00:47:45] Kalen Jordan-1: so why can't they just do it to where you can just shop on the storefront itself? Without any weird loops, like why can't you just do a regular checkout? And I'm sure there's an obvious answer. I'm just trying to think it through to

[00:48:01] David: it's because you have to actually finish the return creation on the loop side. So you're like,

[00:48:07] Kalen Jordan-1: right.

[00:48:07] David: You go in, you put in your order number and your email address, and then you start the return. You're like, I wanna return this thing. And then they give you two options, either return or exchange. And then when you do exchange, you go to the website with the little loop widget, configure your cart, go back, and then you finally finish like, okay, how am I gonna send this item in?

[00:48:28] David: , and all that stuff.

[00:48:30] Kalen Jordan-1: and why not just give them the store credit and let them just do a regular order? Is it, I guess it's because want,

[00:48:40] David: That's an option. Yeah. But it's like a, just a more integrated experience, I guess. And potentially better in terms of revenue

[00:48:48] Kalen Jordan-1: because you

[00:48:49] David: retention, because we also have like,

[00:48:50] Kalen Jordan-1: charge,

[00:48:52] David: yeah, I mean, you, you could return it to credit, but then you have to wait until, like, we don't give you the store credit until we get your item back.

[00:49:00] David: So

[00:49:00] Kalen Jordan-1: uh,

[00:49:02] David: to be like, okay, I, I know that I would buy this other thing instead, so I'm just gonna do it now, and then it'll all happen.

[00:49:09] Kalen Jordan-1: Oh, right, right, right, right, right. That's cool.

[00:49:14] David: We shall see coming out in one and a half wish weeks.

[00:49:22] Kalen Jordan-1: but wait a minute. If you're gonna let them get something else shipped to them without receiving the goods yet and verifying them, why not give 'em the store credit? Isn't that the same? Why not just give 'em the store credit immediately? Isn't that like the

[00:49:36] David: Yeah, so we won't ship it out , immediately. We'll still only ship it out when we get your product back. It's just an easier, like, if you know what you want, you can go do this now

[00:49:46] Kalen Jordan-1: Right. Okay. I gotcha. Gotcha, gotcha, gotcha. Yeah, that's one of those

[00:49:51] David: But yeah,

[00:49:52] Kalen Jordan-1: third party integrations, like they'll be missing something and then you're like, man, I wish I could just,

[00:49:57] David: so close

[00:49:58] Kalen Jordan-1: So close. So

[00:50:01] David: were, we're delayed because, there's different exchange APIs for if you're doing a point of sale exchange or if you're doing an online store native exchange.

[00:50:12] Kalen Jordan-1: right.

[00:50:12] David: that was shenanigans.

[00:50:15] Kalen Jordan-1: Ah,

[00:50:16] David: kind of shenanigans, like , they're gonna unify them at some point in the midterm, but that's my goal for additions.

[00:50:25] David: That'll pay for the ticket if I can figure out what's going on with the exchange APIs.

[00:50:31] Kalen Jordan-1: totally. that's the way to pitch it. I did see a post about the store credit, primitive being,

[00:50:38] David: Mm-hmm.

[00:50:39] Kalen Jordan-1: like finalized or whatever, and I didn't know exactly what that meant. I thought that there was already like a store credit primitive or something like that,

[00:50:51] David: There's gift cards, which is what we use for, like, when someone signs up for store credit for a return, it just creates a gift card.

[00:50:58] Kalen Jordan-1: oh,

[00:50:59] David: But maybe, maybe there's some cooler stuff like, maybe you don't have to remember because with gift cards, , there's no link to your customer account, so you don't, like, you have to go find your email that has the gift code in it.

[00:51:11] David: To use it,

[00:51:12] Kalen Jordan-1: Mm-hmm.

[00:51:13] David: whereas store credit would be linked to your I I imagine it would be in your customer account somewhere.

[00:51:19] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah. Okay. I did do some flow stuff recently with store credit. Did like a. of order amount is store credit and just did

[00:51:30] David: Oh yeah. What does that look like?

[00:51:32] Kalen Jordan-1: oh, I just did like, , there's

[00:51:34] David: Is it a payment method?

[00:51:35] Kalen Jordan-1: Well, no, it was, there's just a mutation to add store credit and, uh, I just hit that and, it just adds it to

[00:51:45] David: How do you use it?

[00:51:46] Kalen Jordan-1: oh, , that's a good question.

[00:51:48] Kalen Jordan-1: I didn't test that.

[00:51:52] David: Just hitting them mutations, baby. It's been mutated.

[00:51:56] Kalen Jordan-1: I hit, I hit 'em in Dip. I hit the mutations in Dip. I'm in

[00:52:02] David: Can't get any response anyway. So just mutate and dip.

[00:52:07] Kalen Jordan-1: Chantel mutate and Dip. There we go. Now we're talking. That's so funny. I'm like, I have no idea. I'm an automation expert dude. I don't actually

[00:52:19] David: Yeah, that's beyond the scope.

[00:52:21] Kalen Jordan-1: I don't, I don't deal with that. Uh, silly checkout. That's funny. There's a cool graph, QL Chrome extension that, um, dude Fabian on Twitter, created

[00:52:34] David: That's another good name. You know, it's good.

[00:52:36] Kalen Jordan-1: yeah, it's solid name. I keep telling myself I should write down full names and stuff, but it just feels a little too formal. Um, actually his Twitter name was Fabian. Shopify themes. So I think he's like, he does like Shopify themes, but, uh,

[00:52:53] David: Ah,

[00:52:53] Kalen Jordan-1: but I don't know how it works. It's a Chrome extension, , when I thought I was gonna have to plug in an API key and all these, all this sort of nonsense, but it just piggybacks on top of the, , admin.

[00:53:06] Kalen Jordan-1: So if you have the admin open, you click, it pops a little quick window, and then it just works and it auto completes and all that kind of stuff. Now you might say, why not just pop into the Shopify GraphQL app if you're in there? And for, normally what I do, but it just takes a minute or two to load.

[00:53:30] Kalen Jordan-1: Like that's, it's like the slowest loading app in the world, the GraphQL app, ,

[00:53:34] David: I.

[00:53:35] Kalen Jordan-1: know what I mean? You use that one, the graph I ql?

[00:53:38] David: Yeah, it doesn't always work. Like there's some permission thing or

[00:53:42] Kalen Jordan-1: a.

[00:53:42] David: doesn't construct the thing, right?

[00:53:44] Kalen Jordan-1: nightmare. It always does this thing where it loads twice, like it initially loads, and then once I start getting ready to type it, reloads, um, and then, yeah, the permissions thing will happen.

[00:53:58] Kalen Jordan-1: So, I was kind of pumped when I saw this little extension and I don't know how it's piggybacking on top of the, I don't even think you need to have GraphQL app installed, although I should test that. I think it just somehow piggybacks on top of the, thing and just, I gotta see how it works because

[00:54:16] David: yeah. How does it authenticate? Like it,

[00:54:18] Kalen Jordan-1: idea.

[00:54:19] Kalen Jordan-1: The more I think about it,

[00:54:20] David: it just works. Magically

[00:54:22] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah. He might be a Russian hacker or something like that, getting into my

[00:54:26] David: might be collecting those keys, baby.

[00:54:29] Kalen Jordan-1: if I was a Russian hacker, I'd go with the name like Fabian, try to throw him off my.

[00:54:34] David: Definitely.

[00:54:35] Kalen Jordan-1: , I'm not gonna use the name like Vladimir, dude. That'll scare, that'll scare people off. So, um, anyways, I haven't actually started using the app. Like I used

[00:54:52] David: okay. Don't have your keys yet.

[00:54:54] Kalen Jordan-1: like I installed it and I like tested it, you know? But then I just realized today I was like, I haven't used this once since I, since I like tested it because I'm just, I have so much muscle memory into using the GraphQL app, even though it like is so

[00:55:10] David: Uh,

[00:55:11] Kalen Jordan-1: that I just always use that, even though now I have this better option, but I haven't gotten used to using the better option yet,

[00:55:19] David: I'll have to check that out. I always just go back to my postman and like, copy and paste an existing one and then modify from there.

[00:55:26] Kalen Jordan-1: right, I use Postman too. But it's just so annoying. Dude. I did again today, I, , duplicated some requests and then the, the duplicated version was not the thing I duplicated. It was like,

[00:55:41] David: Whoops.

[00:55:41] Kalen Jordan-1: God, I hate postman so much.

[00:55:44] David: I always forget to save, so I do a bunch of stuff and then it's like, oh, lost all that.

[00:55:48] Kalen Jordan-1: yeah. Yeah. That's bad news. Dev, environment sync. I did a little bit of research on, on this,

[00:56:00] David: We need it.

[00:56:01] Kalen Jordan-1: We need it.

[00:56:02] Kalen Jordan-1: right? And I had to do some stuff. Well, I had to te okay, I had to test my cart transform for performance on this B2B store. That was like, I needed to test on like a hundred line items, and I went in. And started, adding to cart, but the products I was adding to cart didn't have the meta fields they needed in order to trigger the calculations in the cart transform. So it wasn't, was like a useless test. So then I was like, okay, I gotta go set meta fields on a hundred products. I was like, dude,

[00:56:35] David: Yeah,

[00:56:35] Kalen Jordan-1: I need, I need to

[00:56:36] David: bring all those things over.

[00:56:38] Kalen Jordan-1: I need to sync it

[00:56:39] David: Keys will be the same, but the GIS won't. So what's gonna happen there?

[00:56:45] Kalen Jordan-1: Yep.

[00:56:46] David: this problem for me.

[00:56:47] Kalen Jordan-1: There this dude on LinkedIn, he did, like, he said, he worked on it that day and he, he has linked up a GitHub repository that did the meta field reference, handling. , and I took a quick peek at, I haven't run into anything like that, but I think it, think it, it tries to solve the reference situation, which is kind of cool.

[00:57:10] David: Okay.

[00:57:10] Kalen Jordan-1: Um. So I'll have to take a look at that. But some people use Rewind staging, which don't know if it, I guess it does exist. 'cause this one guy said he used it. I googled it, rewind staging, and somebody said it was an app, like a separate app on top of Rewind. But it's not, there's not a separate

[00:57:30] David: Hmm.

[00:57:31] Kalen Jordan-1: Rewinds the only app. So I think it's a, a feature you can enable, within Rewind. But I couldn't find really good info. I think I'd need to do a demo, which I don't, I don't really believe in doing

[00:57:45] David: Jet pack.

[00:57:46] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah,

[00:57:48] David: Just show me, give me a video

[00:57:50] Kalen Jordan-1: yeah,

[00:57:51] David: I'm out.

[00:57:52] Kalen Jordan-1: yeah. I'm, I'm not into that, but apparently it, it might, I mean it's, literally, that's what it does. It's even named Rewind staging. 'cause it's, it syncs up your staging environment. So

[00:58:06] David: Okay.

[00:58:07] Kalen Jordan-1: I really

[00:58:07] David: Yeah, it seems possible. It's just like

[00:58:09] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah.

[00:58:10] David: Shopify doesn't seem like they're focused on it, but maybe there's an app that can do it.

[00:58:14] Kalen Jordan-1: Yeah. I would totally bill this as an app, by the way, if you need this on some kind of a pa payment basis, I'll

[00:58:23] David: Can I pay you $5 a month?

[00:58:27] Kalen Jordan-1: let's

[00:58:28] David: That's all my budget for apps.

[00:58:31] Kalen Jordan-1: let's make it seven I'll do it this weekend, dude. now I can see how you are with these app vendors. Dude, you just, you just chop 'em off at the knees, man. ,

[00:58:45] David: Hey, I pay for some apps. All right. Not that many though.

[00:58:51] Kalen Jordan-1: , but yeah, I

[00:58:51] David: I always feel like. I'm always scared to like install more apps. I dunno.

[00:58:57] Kalen Jordan-1: I would like to work on this. If I could find an excuse to work on it. But then, you know, somebody else said is they said, well, what you should do is just have your ERP sync to your dev environment. , and I was like, which actually this case would work. 'cause it's the NetSuite thing. You could have NetSuite sandbox sink into Dev,

[00:59:15] David: Yeah.

[00:59:16] Kalen Jordan-1: but you know, for one, because of the iPASS usage charges, they're wanting to use that IPAs as minimally as humanly possible. So that's sort of an

[00:59:26] David: Yep,

[00:59:27] Kalen Jordan-1: Secondly, NetSuite Sandbox is all added date. Everything's a mess in there.

[00:59:33] David: yep.

[00:59:33] Kalen Jordan-1: So, um

[00:59:37] David: NetSuite is annoying me this week. 'cause we're we got like they, they're changing this. They're changing their suite analytics endpoint to be something completely different. And this is gonna take like three months of my life.

[00:59:52] Kalen Jordan-1: Dang.

[00:59:53] David: And I, I, I feel like I just need to like, blow up our data pipeline and do something completely new outta Shopify.

[00:59:58] David: Instead,

[00:59:59] Kalen Jordan-1: That's crazy.

[01:00:00] David: I,

[01:00:00] Kalen Jordan-1: What is sweet Analytics?

[01:00:05] David: it's the, it's the dumb name that they give like, , the ODBC connector to their, internal data warehouse.

[01:00:12] Kalen Jordan-1: Oh,

[01:00:13] David: So like, uh, we have it where NetSuite, gets the data, uh. Uh oh five. Tran gets the data out of NetSuite and loads it into BigQuery. And then on top of BigQuery, there's this thing called DBT that transforms all that stuff into new tables that are actually useful.

[01:00:31] David: And the NetSuite layer of this, so like four layers deep is like deprecating the current way that we connect. And so like I gotta blow stuff up anyway. And if we're at this, I might just like change how everything happens for our reporting,

[01:00:49] Kalen Jordan-1: Right,

[01:00:50] David: which is gonna be a bit of a project.

[01:00:52] Kalen Jordan-1: right. That sounds rough.

[01:00:57] David: It'll be fine.

[01:00:59] Kalen Jordan-1: may the force be with you?

[01:01:02] David: Thank you, sir.

[01:01:04] Kalen Jordan-1: I think that's a good, I think that's a good note to end on. I do have three more things on the list,

[01:01:10] David: Oh, make good progress though.

[01:01:12] Kalen Jordan-1: we're, yeah, we made some solid progress. We moved swiftly through it.

[01:01:16] David: What was the title of this?

[01:01:18] Kalen Jordan-1: Oh,

[01:01:19] David: uh, mutate and Dip.

[01:01:26] Kalen Jordan-1: Nice. So I think the pen and paper situation worked. I

[01:01:32] David: Yeah,

[01:01:32] Kalen Jordan-1: think

[01:01:32] David: no, that was good. I, I secretly had it.